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	<link>https://glendalarke.com/2009/08/via-cheryls-mewsings-i-found-this-from/</link>
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		<title>
		By: Victoria Dixon		</title>
		<link>https://glendalarke.com/2009/08/via-cheryls-mewsings-i-found-this-from/#comment-20612</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Victoria Dixon]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Aug 2009 06:14:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-20612</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Yes, a vast difference. I got so upset I stopped reading and so I&#039;m not sure if they didn&#039;t catch what he meant or if they don&#039;t care about the distinctions he made. I got the feeling - at least with a lot of them - that it was the latter.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, a vast difference. I got so upset I stopped reading and so I&#39;m not sure if they didn&#39;t catch what he meant or if they don&#39;t care about the distinctions he made. I got the feeling &#8211; at least with a lot of them &#8211; that it was the latter.</p>
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		<title>
		By: glenda larke		</title>
		<link>https://glendalarke.com/2009/08/via-cheryls-mewsings-i-found-this-from/#comment-20611</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[glenda larke]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Aug 2009 05:27:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-20611</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Hmmm. I hadn&#039;t read the comments. I think a number of the commentators just didn&#039;t get the distinction that I thought Kay made: there&#039;s a vast difference between a) having a real-person character in a novel seen through the eyes of other not-real characters - and b) getting inside that real-person and dealing with his/her thoughts and intimacies.
To me, one is fine, the other dubious.

And I would say too, there&#039;s a vast difference between a) writing a novel after loads of research and trying to make the representation of a real-person character as close to what we know about his life - and b) making something up about the real-person which you know or guess to be untrue in order to further your plot.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmmm. I hadn&#39;t read the comments. I think a number of the commentators just didn&#39;t get the distinction that I thought Kay made: there&#39;s a vast difference between a) having a real-person character in a novel seen through the eyes of other not-real characters &#8211; and b) getting inside that real-person and dealing with his/her thoughts and intimacies.<br />
To me, one is fine, the other dubious.</p>
<p>And I would say too, there&#39;s a vast difference between a) writing a novel after loads of research and trying to make the representation of a real-person character as close to what we know about his life &#8211; and b) making something up about the real-person which you know or guess to be untrue in order to further your plot.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Victoria Dixon		</title>
		<link>https://glendalarke.com/2009/08/via-cheryls-mewsings-i-found-this-from/#comment-20610</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Victoria Dixon]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Aug 2009 04:22:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-20610</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[YIKES! I just read the article and the resulting comments. My God, we are a screwed up people. (Shakes her head.) Some of what I read five minutes ago still makes me tremble with disgust. Entitlement is too little of a word for what some of the readers suggest. I&#039;m too disturbed to continue.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>YIKES! I just read the article and the resulting comments. My God, we are a screwed up people. (Shakes her head.) Some of what I read five minutes ago still makes me tremble with disgust. Entitlement is too little of a word for what some of the readers suggest. I&#39;m too disturbed to continue.</p>
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		<item>
		<title>
		By: Victoria Dixon		</title>
		<link>https://glendalarke.com/2009/08/via-cheryls-mewsings-i-found-this-from/#comment-20609</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Victoria Dixon]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Aug 2009 03:52:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-20609</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Thanks for the link, Glenda! I appreciate it. You do know Kay has a new one due out next year? I believe in April. It&#039;s called &#034;Under Heaven.&#034;]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the link, Glenda! I appreciate it. You do know Kay has a new one due out next year? I believe in April. It&#39;s called &quot;Under Heaven.&quot;</p>
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		<title>
		By: glenda larke		</title>
		<link>https://glendalarke.com/2009/08/via-cheryls-mewsings-i-found-this-from/#comment-20608</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[glenda larke]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Aug 2009 01:18:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-20608</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Well, the narrators are. I&#039;m the one that&#039;s ... not.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, the narrators are. I&#39;m the one that&#39;s &#8230; not.</p>
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		<title>
		By: glenda larke		</title>
		<link>https://glendalarke.com/2009/08/via-cheryls-mewsings-i-found-this-from/#comment-20607</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[glenda larke]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Aug 2009 01:02:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-20607</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Hendo, that&#039;s sort of fine with me, although I must admit I would still feel queasy about say, fiction that turns Winston Churchill into a raging paedophile or Florence Nightingale into a sadist. There is a limit to what I think can be sanitised by a blithe, &#034;Oh, but this is all fiction, you know.&#034;

Really, Sharyn? Lol...! Maybe that&#039;s the ultimate accolade for the writers/director/actors? I must admit I have been taken aback by people who think that the moment you use first person narrative, you the author are the character.

Is that why two of my first person narrators have been tall athletic types with great hairdos? Not.

Sigh.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hendo, that&#39;s sort of fine with me, although I must admit I would still feel queasy about say, fiction that turns Winston Churchill into a raging paedophile or Florence Nightingale into a sadist. There is a limit to what I think can be sanitised by a blithe, &quot;Oh, but this is all fiction, you know.&quot;</p>
<p>Really, Sharyn? Lol&#8230;! Maybe that&#39;s the ultimate accolade for the writers/director/actors? I must admit I have been taken aback by people who think that the moment you use first person narrative, you the author are the character.</p>
<p>Is that why two of my first person narrators have been tall athletic types with great hairdos? Not.</p>
<p>Sigh.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Hendo		</title>
		<link>https://glendalarke.com/2009/08/via-cheryls-mewsings-i-found-this-from/#comment-20606</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Hendo]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Aug 2009 00:39:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-20606</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Apologies Amanda, and Glenda, I didn&#039;t mean to suggest that an author shouldn&#039;t do anything, just that they should be aware of these issues that we&#039;re discussing. I don&#039;t think it&#039;s possible to create a fantasy world without having some level of influence from our world sneaking in.

I agree though, authors should either strive for the same level of accuracy that historians aspire to, or make it very clear that they&#039;re presenting a fictional account. It&#039;s fairly standard these days for historical fiction to have an acknowledgements page that lists the author&#039;s sources and explains any deviations that they may have made.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Apologies Amanda, and Glenda, I didn&#39;t mean to suggest that an author shouldn&#39;t do anything, just that they should be aware of these issues that we&#39;re discussing. I don&#39;t think it&#39;s possible to create a fantasy world without having some level of influence from our world sneaking in.</p>
<p>I agree though, authors should either strive for the same level of accuracy that historians aspire to, or make it very clear that they&#39;re presenting a fictional account. It&#39;s fairly standard these days for historical fiction to have an acknowledgements page that lists the author&#39;s sources and explains any deviations that they may have made.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Sharyn		</title>
		<link>https://glendalarke.com/2009/08/via-cheryls-mewsings-i-found-this-from/#comment-20605</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sharyn]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Aug 2009 00:33:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-20605</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[There are plenty of people who know fully believe that Jack and Rose, from Titanic, really existed.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are plenty of people who know fully believe that Jack and Rose, from Titanic, really existed.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Satima Flavell		</title>
		<link>https://glendalarke.com/2009/08/via-cheryls-mewsings-i-found-this-from/#comment-20604</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Satima Flavell]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Aug 2009 23:18:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-20604</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I&#039;m with you and GGK on all counts, Glenda. It is disrespectful to put people into stories and give them words and actions that they did not speak or do. Kay sidesteps the problem neatly by creating an imaginary world that is obviously based on medieval Europe and even has some of the same characters - but the place names and personal names are different. Jacqueline Carey does something similar, although her characters are purely fictional AFAIK. In both cases, readers are treated to great stories that are free to be as imaginative as the writer chooses, even to the use of magic.

I don&#039;t mind watching movies based on history but I get angry when they depart from the known facts:-(]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#39;m with you and GGK on all counts, Glenda. It is disrespectful to put people into stories and give them words and actions that they did not speak or do. Kay sidesteps the problem neatly by creating an imaginary world that is obviously based on medieval Europe and even has some of the same characters &#8211; but the place names and personal names are different. Jacqueline Carey does something similar, although her characters are purely fictional AFAIK. In both cases, readers are treated to great stories that are free to be as imaginative as the writer chooses, even to the use of magic.</p>
<p>I don&#39;t mind watching movies based on history but I get angry when they depart from the known facts:-(</p>
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		<title>
		By: glenda larke		</title>
		<link>https://glendalarke.com/2009/08/via-cheryls-mewsings-i-found-this-from/#comment-20603</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[glenda larke]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Aug 2009 23:05:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-20603</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Exactly, Amanda. I use cultural influences all the time. I might one day even model my characters on a real life person (although I have not as yet, not to any large degree).

If I was writing a historical novel, I would - at least on some level - people it with persons once living.

Where I agree with Kay is that this involves some responsibility. Jo mentioned Heyer, who wrote books - fiction - which sometimes gave quite large roles to people like the Duke of Wellington or other real personages. She put speech into their mouths. BUT whatever they said was absolutely in character with what we know about them, through their writings, their deeds or what observers saw or heard.

What Kay objects to, and I do to, is using these people as PoV characters, as if we are inside their heads, thinking their thoughts...becoming intimate with them as if we were them. Well, we aren&#039;t. And we shouldn&#039;t imply that we have this inner knowledge when we don&#039;t, even if the book is fiction.

You are absolutely right, Hendo - history changes depending on what sources we have and who is viewing them. To me, that is all the more reason why we shouldn&#039;t pretend we are the historical personage,  knowing what went on in their heads. It implies an intimacy that never existed. 

Cultural appropriation is something that arouses deep passions. My personal feeling? If I want to use another culture, and call it by its true name, or imply that it is true representation, then it had better be damn accurate.

If I appropriate it and call it something else, then it is mine to do what I like with - as long as I make it clear it is not real.

Writing alternate history is something else again, but at least everyone knows that this is not a true representation, any more than there are really fairies at the bottom of my garden.

I guess it all boils down to being honest.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Exactly, Amanda. I use cultural influences all the time. I might one day even model my characters on a real life person (although I have not as yet, not to any large degree).</p>
<p>If I was writing a historical novel, I would &#8211; at least on some level &#8211; people it with persons once living.</p>
<p>Where I agree with Kay is that this involves some responsibility. Jo mentioned Heyer, who wrote books &#8211; fiction &#8211; which sometimes gave quite large roles to people like the Duke of Wellington or other real personages. She put speech into their mouths. BUT whatever they said was absolutely in character with what we know about them, through their writings, their deeds or what observers saw or heard.</p>
<p>What Kay objects to, and I do to, is using these people as PoV characters, as if we are inside their heads, thinking their thoughts&#8230;becoming intimate with them as if we were them. Well, we aren&#39;t. And we shouldn&#39;t imply that we have this inner knowledge when we don&#39;t, even if the book is fiction.</p>
<p>You are absolutely right, Hendo &#8211; history changes depending on what sources we have and who is viewing them. To me, that is all the more reason why we shouldn&#39;t pretend we are the historical personage,  knowing what went on in their heads. It implies an intimacy that never existed. </p>
<p>Cultural appropriation is something that arouses deep passions. My personal feeling? If I want to use another culture, and call it by its true name, or imply that it is true representation, then it had better be damn accurate.</p>
<p>If I appropriate it and call it something else, then it is mine to do what I like with &#8211; as long as I make it clear it is not real.</p>
<p>Writing alternate history is something else again, but at least everyone knows that this is not a true representation, any more than there are really fairies at the bottom of my garden.</p>
<p>I guess it all boils down to being honest.</p>
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